War Crimes
THE PRESIDENT then raised the matter of war crimes.
MR. MOLOTOV stated that the Soviet delegation had agreed to accept as a basis for discussion the British document on this subject. They had one small amendment to propose. After the word “criminals” in the last sentence the Soviet delegation proposed the insertion of “such as Goering, etc.”
MR. ATTLEE pointed out that it was difficult to select defendants to be included. Perhaps they would want to put more in. He thought it was best to leave the selection of names of war criminals to people working with this problem.
MR. STALIN replied that the Soviet amendment did not imply that those named would necessarily be judged. The Soviet proposal states “such as.” He contended that we cannot further avoid mention of some persons. The people want war criminals to be named. If we keep silent regarding the names of these criminals, it will cast a shadow over our work. It would be a political gain to name these persons and European public opinion would be satisfied. If they are named as an example only, there can be no difficulty. If none of the names proposed were wrongfully accused, he could see no ground for objection.
MR. BYRNES pointed out that when the matter had been discussed yesterday he had agreed that it would be unwise to attempt to determine the guilt of certain individuals and name them. Every country has its favorite Nazi war criminal and if the Conference failed to include such favorites it would be difficult to explain why they were not on the list.
Mr. Stalin replied that that was why the Soviet amendment stated “such as … and others.”
MR. ATTLEE stated that he could not see how a list of names would strengthen the document. He stated that he understood there is some doubt about whether Hitler was alive and he was not on the list.
MR. STALIN replied that Hitler was not at our disposal.
MR. ATTLEE stated that the amendment gave instances.
MR. STALIN thereupon replied that he was willing to make a concession. Hitler should be added.
MR. ATTLEE remarked that he thought the world well knew who were the major war criminals.
MR. STALIN agreed but stated that some people might think that we intended to save the major criminals if they were not mentioned.
MR. BYRNES thereupon stated that this morning he had talked to Justice Jackson, a Justice of the American Supreme Court who represented the United States on the War Crimes Commission now in London. Justice Jackson had expressed the hope that the Commission meeting this afternoon or tomorrow morning would agree on an international tribunal. If the Marshal could instruct his representatives to try to reach agreement it would be well. Justice Jackson was telephoning Mr. Byrnes tomorrow morning concerning this tribunal. An announcement on this subject would be good news to the people who favored a speedy trial for these war criminals.
MR. STALIN stated that this was another question.
MR. BYRNES pointed out that such an announcement could be included in the statement and make it very effective.
MR. STALIN insisted that if some of the most hated war criminals were not named the Conference’s decision would not have its full effect. He had consulted some Russian lawyers on this subject who agreed with him.
THE PRESIDENT remarked that since he expected to hear from the Conference in London tomorrow this could be discussed tomorrow together with the question of the German fleet.
MR. STALIN agreed.
International Waterways
THE PRESIDENT stated that he was greatly interested in the matter now under discussion. He wished a discussion regarding the freedom of waterways and if possible a declaration on this subject. He had discussed this question at some length on July 23 and it had then been referred to a committee which he understood had never met.
THE PRESIDENT stated that it was his honest opinion that some definite proposal should be worked out. European waterways had been a hot bed for breeding wars during European history. He believed that proper control would bring about very good results. He realized that it might not be possible to reach agreement at this Conference because of the necessity for detailed consideration, but he considered the matter to be of vital importance to the peace of Europe.
MR. ATTLEE stated that he was in general agreement with the President on this point.
MR. STALIN stated that this question had arisen in connection with the Black Sea Straits. He pointed out that the Black Sea Straits question has been postponed. Other parts of the question needed study in order to be decided.
MR. MOLOTOV interjected to state that it was a new question even for those of us who know this subject.
THE PRESIDENT then suggested that the matter be referred to the Council of Foreign Ministers. There would be plenty of time then to get the facts from experts.
MR. STALIN and MR. ATTLEE agreed.
Notification to Polish Government Regarding Polish Boundaries
THE PRESIDENT inquired whether it would be proper officially to notify the Polish Government of the decision reached regarding Polish boundaries.
MR. STALIN remarked that this would be a good thing.
THE PRESIDENT suggested the appointment of representatives of each country to notify the Polish Government.
MR. STALIN stated that Polish representatives should be invited to the meeting to be informed of the Conference’s decision.
THE PRESIDENT stated “As you wish.”
Communiqué
MR. BEVIN stated that the issuance of the communiqué should be arranged.
THE PRESIDENT pointed out that a committee had been appointed and he understood that it was up to date. The President asked about meeting times tomorrow.
MR. STALIN stated that it should be as the President liked.
THE PRESIDENT suggested 4:00 p.m.
MR. BYRNES interjected to state that the Foreign Ministers were meeting at 11:00 a.m.
THE PRESIDENT then asked whether the Big Three could meet at 3:00 p.m.
MR. STALIN agreed and stated that they should first meet at 3:00 p.m. and again in the evening.
All agreed and the meeting adjourned.